Standard DoM / Level II Market Depth view doesn't seem to be right?

lorddevil
07 Jan 2016, 12:28

So noone able to explain this strange behavior? Didn't anyone of you wonder too, why the DoM view is almost the same on both sides - just some minor fluctuation in aggregated price listings... nothing of any value though...

I just wonder because this feature gets advertised as Level II Market Depth, however this can't be true or there is something seriously wrong - maybe Spotware can explain?

scandisk
11 Jan 2016, 03:58

Hi Lorddevil

I was am also wondering about this too! About maybe a 5 months it was working but not anymore?? Also I am wondering if Ctrader is safe from broker manipulation? They claim that the Ctrader is fool proof!!  Time will tell?  It will leak in the news or from some client then eventually I will sue them!

This will be interesting response from Spotware on the DOM????

MaVe
11 Jan 2016, 14:52

RE: Depth of Market

Take a look at the Spotware Youtube channel

Video: Depth of Market - cTrader

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KcC3maFOz2w

lorddevil
11 Jan 2016, 15:01

I guess we all know this video, but actually it just tells us how it should work :). Right now as you can see by my initial post this feature is totally useless - the DoM view doesn't seem to work with any broker or there is some bug and/or wrong data.... That's why I hope to get a reply and explanation from Spotware or from a broker... !

I mean it is a advertised feature which right now has absolutely no use at all - really curious because since it effects all ctrader brokers - why there are not more people complaining?

scandisk
12 Jan 2016, 18:45

I am guessing nobody even knows about the DOM features?? Regardless I am sure Spotware will chime in and blame the broker for this or say it's up to your broker to feed this which is probably B.S. This is the biggest problem with Spotware and our brokers both can blame each other without any care for there clients but in reality we are dealing with market makers who will screw you any chance they get!!

scandisk
12 Jan 2016, 18:57

It was working before all the updates because I used trade with it and know not working at all!!  I am waiting to hear back from my broker??? Did you contact your broker?

lorddevil
12 Jan 2016, 20:20

RE:

scandisk said:

It was working before all the updates because I used trade with it and know not working at all!!  I am waiting to hear back from my broker??? Did you contact your broker?

Nope I haven't talked to our broker yet about this because from what I can see it is happening with almost ALL cTrader brokers (so you maybe right in assuming it is a bug). I have demo accounts at several ctrader brokers - and all are showing the same strange behaviour of almost same sell and buy quantities (all that differs from broker to broker is the amount). So they say they are no market maker brokers but if we can trust the DoM view of cTrader than it would tell us that all ECN's still market makers, thus having the same buy and sell position depth, due to the fact of taking the opposite part...

But since all those brokers advertise being ECN it looks really strange to me (and you say it worked before?)... so Spotware... what do you think about this issue? I mean ATM it is totally useless, but you are advertising this feature as Level II Market depth - so what is happening here?

Thanks in advance for your help,

Oliver

scandisk
13 Jan 2016, 09:56

This post was removed by moderator.

Spotware
13 Jan 2016, 15:39

Dear Traders,

Spotware is the technology provider who provides services to brokers. It is up to the Brokers which LPs they will use to stream prices and up to the LPs on how much volume is available for the prices they stream. Due to contractual agreement, we are not at liberty to disclose any information of this type. In general, any questions regarding execution, prices, account should be addressed to your Brokers.

lorddevil
13 Jan 2016, 23:41

RE:

Spotware said:

Dear Traders,

Spotware is the technology provider who provides services to brokers. It is up to the Brokers which LPs they will use to stream prices and up to the LPs on how much volume is available for the prices they stream. Due to contractual agreement, we are not at liberty to disclose any information of this type. In general, any questions regarding execution, prices, account should be addressed to your Brokers.

Thanks for your answer, well but since we can see this behavior with any cTrader Broker out there - I think there is definite something wrong and worth investigating? I have already contacted my broker and they moved it up to the management team, because they found it strange too  - so hopefully I can get an reply from there. But still some people say that it had worked a few versions ago (which I can't comment as I haven't use it back then) and if you are advertising a feature of your software - which actually would be a great one - it would be sad to see that this issue is ignored - I mean we all know that it can't be ture that the volumes on both sides are almost equal everytime...

So hopefully we can figure out what is wrong here, otherwise it would be better to just remove this feature - as now it is just very confusing and making all ecn broker using ctrader look like market makers.

trend_meanreversion
14 Jan 2016, 13:35 ( Updated at: 21 Dec 2023, 09:20 )

My humble 2 cents lorddevil on this issue..i think you are looking at vWAP DOM view which shows same volume on both sides because that's what it should reflect ie..vWAP price for a given volume on each side.

vWAP mode

Standard Mode ->  This shows the real ECN volume as per brokers LPs. Unfortunately it is aggregated at volume level so you can't distinguish it it is coming from LP1 or LP2 or combination of both.

This has been my understanding so far but i might be wrong.

lorddevil
14 Jan 2016, 14:38 ( Updated at: 21 Dec 2023, 09:20 )

RE:

trend_meanreversion said:

My humble 2 cents lorddevil on this issue..i think you are looking at vWAP DOM view which shows same volume on both sides because that's what it should reflect ie..vWAP price for a given volume on each side.

vWAP mode

 

Standard Mode ->  This shows the real ECN volume as per brokers LPs. Unfortunately it is aggregated at volume level so you can't distinguish it it is coming from LP1 or LP2 or combination of both.

 

This has been my understanding so far but i might be wrong.

 

 

 

Hey there... well actually I am talking about this Standard DoM view. As you can see in your screenshot the volume is about the same on both sides - and that is what is actually very strange. We all know markets move because we have different Volumens on Sell and Buy - but if you follow the DoM view over time in cTrader its pretty much almost the same on each side at any time period with all brokers - and this is something which can't be true - if it would be true than it would mean the LPs are market makers because they always take opposite positions so the volume is always almost exactly the same!

Don't know if you have ever experienced a real Depth of Market Level II view - but there you would have seen that Volumens always differ across the board.

lorddevil
14 Jan 2016, 15:01 ( Updated at: 21 Dec 2023, 09:20 )

Look that's a snapshot from now... I mean we have a discrepancy of only 300k Pounds and 500k Euro... and if you follow the view... its always almost the same (surely it changes a bit)- but for me this doesn't look any useful... so where is the catch?

Or am I seeing something wrong here, but shouldn't we see much bigger differences between sell and buy positions in volumes?

scandisk
14 Jan 2016, 18:49

RE:

Spotware said:

Dear Traders,

Spotware is the technology provider who provides services to brokers. It is up to the Brokers which LPs they will use to stream prices and up to the LPs on how much volume is available for the prices they stream. Due to contractual agreement, we are not at liberty to disclose any information of this type. In general, any questions regarding execution, prices, account should be addressed to your Brokers.

Well I contacted my broker and they aren't changing it back to real DOM level 2 and why don't you just come out and tell everyone Level 2 doesn't exist on the Ctrader platform anymore???

Anyone who wants to know just has to watch the video and see that in the video, the Standard DOM is working perfect showing real trading volume which was working a few months back is no longer working so look for your selves in the video the Standard DOM has changed and now doesn't show real volume flows.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KcC3maFOz2w 

trend_meanreversion
15 Jan 2016, 01:40 ( Updated at: 21 Dec 2023, 09:20 )

RE:

lorddevil said:

Look that's a snapshot from now... I mean we have a discrepancy of only 300k Pounds and 500k Euro... and if you follow the view... its always almost the same (surely it changes a bit)- but for me this doesn't look any useful... so where is the catch?

Or am I seeing something wrong here, but shouldn't we see much bigger differences between sell and buy positions in volumes?

Lorddevil, i have access to real price feeds from banks and i can see that even in those there is pretty much balanced buy and sell volume ( approx) at any point in time so cTrader Standard DOM looks fine to me. [ i don't know how to use that information successfully for my trading though yet ] . There is normally a minimum commitment from a LP to provide quotes for 'X' volume so it am not surprised to see pretty balanced order book. I suppose only Spotware team can clarify the technical side of it.

lorddevil
15 Jan 2016, 13:13 ( Updated at: 21 Dec 2023, 09:20 )

RE: RE:

trend_meanreversion said:

lorddevil said:

Look that's a snapshot from now... I mean we have a discrepancy of only 300k Pounds and 500k Euro... and if you follow the view... its always almost the same (surely it changes a bit)- but for me this doesn't look any useful... so where is the catch?

Or am I seeing something wrong here, but shouldn't we see much bigger differences between sell and buy positions in volumes?

 

Lorddevil, i have access to real price feeds from banks and i can see that even in those there is pretty much balanced buy and sell volume ( approx) at any point in time so cTrader Standard DOM looks fine to me. [ i don't know how to use that information successfully for my trading though yet ] . There is normally a minimum commitment from a LP to provide quotes for 'X' volume so it am not surprised to see pretty balanced order book. I suppose only Spotware team can clarify the technical side of it.

 

I see but then I stll wonder what this market depth is all about - looks like some random numbers than. Just look at my example both show almost exactly the same volume seperation. When I am looking right now again at the charts - its almost the same as yesterday... even the 1m, 4m, 20m, 40m is again here all the time for both currencies... - I mean if we are trading real makets here those numbers should be different most of the time - not always the same. For me this looks very suspious to either have a bug and wrong data or those values are just generated by LPs at will.....

scandisk
20 Jan 2016, 19:46

Please watch the video and tell me whats different??   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KcC3maFOz2w 

lorddevil
20 Jan 2016, 19:55

RE:

scandisk said:

Please watch the video and tell me whats different??   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KcC3maFOz2w 

And that is what it makes it really even more confusing... on USD/CHF I have exactly the same behavior as on the video...that looks pretty ok...!

But when looking at the EUR/USD etc, it doesn't matter at which time the values are almost always the same -> 1,4,5,9,20+m (throughout the whole day and now for over a week no changes) - so this can't be true... but as it looks like they aren't interested in this issue... so for now this feature is really useless... :(

jamiebitcon@outlook.com
03 Jan 2017, 12:37

RE:

_​​i agree also every currencie pairs add up to 9.6m check them out

lorddevil said:

Hello everyone,

I am curious about what you can see in the cTraders Standard DoM info screen available for different currencies. As far as I know it should display the level II market depth. But how comes that its always the same Volume on both Sides - BUY and SELL? Does this mean that all our NDD ECN brokers are still market makers and every sell receives a buy and vice versa??? This is pretty strange and confusing or?

I know there are differences between the ctrader brokers as they are all having different liquidity providers, but regardless of those providers its everywhere the same -> Same amount of buy and sell Volumes listed in the cTraders Standard DoM view... so what is this view actually telling us?

Thanks in advance for clarification.

 

jamiebitcon@outlook.com
03 Jan 2017, 12:48

RE: RE:

jamiebitcon@outlook.com said:

_​​i agree also every currencie pairs add up to 9.6m check them out

​wow i just relised the dates and its been a year a nothing has been changed .

 

 

lorddevil said:

Hello everyone,

I am curious about what you can see in the cTraders Standard DoM info screen available for different currencies. As far as I know it should display the level II market depth. But how comes that its always the same Volume on both Sides - BUY and SELL? Does this mean that all our NDD ECN brokers are still market makers and every sell receives a buy and vice versa??? This is pretty strange and confusing or?

I know there are differences between the ctrader brokers as they are all having different liquidity providers, but regardless of those providers its everywhere the same -> Same amount of buy and sell Volumes listed in the cTraders Standard DoM view... so what is this view actually telling us?

Thanks in advance for clarification.

 

 

simitenbiri
01 Jan 2018, 00:57

RE: CTrader DOM

jamiebitcon@outlook.com said:

_​​i agree also every currencie pairs add up to 9.6m check them out

 

 

lorddevil said:

Hello everyone,

I am curious about what you can see in the cTraders Standard DoM info screen available for different currencies. As far as I know it should display the level II market depth. But how comes that its always the same Volume on both Sides - BUY and SELL? Does this mean that all our NDD ECN brokers are still market makers and every sell receives a buy and vice versa??? This is pretty strange and confusing or?

I know there are differences between the ctrader brokers as they are all having different liquidity providers, but regardless of those providers its everywhere the same -> Same amount of buy and sell Volumes listed in the cTraders Standard DoM view... so what is this view actually telling us?

Thanks in advance for clarification.

 

Interestingly I can't see anything to do with DOM !,  I am wondering if this is to do with the "features" of the new version 2.01  ?   or  this feature have been turned off by the broker?

PanagiotisCharalampous
02 Jan 2018, 11:03 ( Updated at: 21 Dec 2023, 09:20 )

Hi simitenbiri,

Depth of Market is available in the Symbol's information panel. You can access the information panel by right clicking on a symbol. See screenshot below. 

Let me know if this helps.

Best Regards,

Panagiotis